is using the word fa***t jokingly offensive?

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hi i dont mean to be rude here i have absolutely no problem with homosexuality and one of the best people i know is gay im really sorry if this does hurt you.

There was this kid in my class who has been for a while mimicking/mocking my voice which is high pitched im not sure whether jokingly or not other kids in the class sometimes call him fa***t jokingly im almost sure. so anyway today he was mocking my voice again and i ignored him like i always do. and he just continue to do it. the teacher told him to stop and he didn't listen .
then i whispered to the person at the next table "i use to wonder why they called him a fa***t." and the person said it out loud in front of the class Then he didn't stop so after a while i said "cut it out" and he still didnt stop so i said "i have absolutely no problem with homosexuality but god"

then at when class was about to end i told the kid at the next table along the lines of " i dont want to be mean but he was just f*****g annoying. then the other kid came up to my deck acted like he was going to punch me ( but then put his hand back than said to the kid at the next table to hold him back ( i think it was pretty clear he was joking) and we were all laughing.

It felt really weird and confusing but at the same time it felt kind of good to joke around ( If that's what we were doing - honesty i dont know) I just wanted him to stop mocking me or at least find out if he was joking or if he was trying to me mean honestly i was just annoyed.

Do you think my friend who is gay would be offended ? I don't want to ask him because i don't want to hurt him make me lose his respect or how he thinks of me as innocent. Should i feel guilty?
what should have i said instead?
i have no idea why i even blurted that out in the first place.

Last edited by jenisautistic on 08 Nov 2013, 8:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.

When I went to school I had a friend who favorite word was fa***t. He used it liberaly and often to great comic effect.

However, I don't believe you can use the word on a person non-offensively. The orginal meaning of the word is of course a small stick to light a fire. But if you apply it to a person, its meaning is offensive.

I'm also not going to say that jokes are non-offensive. Jokes are offensive, they are just attempting to sidestep the "getting into trouble" part.

Does you're friend take offense? That depends on how well he knows you. If he does know you well then perhaps he doesn't take offence. Beyound that, we can't say.

Didn't Southpark cover this?
You can use the word Fag*ot if you are one, but not if you're not one.

In general, it's never a good idea to use words that harm.

Having said this, I find the use of the word f***** offensive even when used jokingly.

Jen, I take a little different view of the use of epithets of all kinds. As is the case with foul or obscene language, I view the use of epithets as a breach of good manners and common decency rather than as some kind of weird PC crime. Having said this, no word is funny if it is used to insult or hurt others. So, I would make a point of avoiding such language. We aspies should know better than anybody else what it's like to be the butt of offensive language and jokes, and we shouldn't be doing the same to others. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

That is so true especially since ive been bullied and taken advange of my whole life

why do you think our brains even think of these hurtful things its so weird sometimes i seriously think something and then automatically go wtf brain.

I hope you don't beat yourself up for what you think. The important thing is not to act on bad thoughts.

To my way of thinking, there is no single answer to this question.

Some of us have been trying to repossess the word, much as we (and others) have done with, "Queer." But there are others for whom the word will always and forever be a reminder of childhood bullying and schoolyard taunting.

I think that, as with all language, the speaker must know their audience. There are modes of speech that are perfectly acceptable in some environments, but wildly inappropriate in others.

If your listener doesn't know what to expect, and is offended by your words, then, "I was only joking," isn't going to provide an excuse.

The Spanish equivalent of the word f****t is "marica". Something very interesting happened with that word around 10 year ago, I don't know exactly how it happened but it's use became widespread among young people as a way to refer to other people you're in friendly terms, to the extent in many circumstances, within Colombian slang it could be translated as "dude". (I remember a Mexican who got pissed the first time he was called marica when he was part of a mostly Colombian group, but he later got used to it). I don't see anything inherently wrong about using one of many arbitrary letter sequences that happens to have a negative meaning associated with it as long as there is no negative intent behind such use. I'd take care of not being heard by people who do have a problem with it for the sake of politeness and avoiding unnecessary conflict, but that's about it.

Last edited by Shatbat on 09 Nov 2013, 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

There is this article also to add to the mix:

Much of the time it's the intent behind the language that's the issue.

You could have a very homophobic or whatever intent behind a certain phrase or the way it's worded, but technically it's not offensive. You can also use words that are normally quite offensive but not mean anything aggressive by them. (And of course, you can offensive slurs to deliberately be offensive.)

As for fa***ts: I've not had them in ages.

Shat: the same is happening with the word maricon right now - it too is right in the middle of that transition that you spoke of.

And Teq: as to your example, I'm pretty sure that's why in Spanish you can call someone negro or negrito purely as a describing word (with no connotation for the former and positive connotations to refer to a person for the latter). In English, using black for the same use, has negative connotations. And obviously, using n****r, the meaning of the word itself is simply unacceptable, not to mention negative connotations. Meanings of words and connotations really do matter.

In the case of the OP, fa***t as a word has an unacceptable meaning and negative connotations in the best case scenario. As a word, you only use it with the intent to offend or cause a heightened emotional state when using it on a person. I would suggest they were either not joking, bullying, or using unacceptable jokes.

Meanings and connotations certainly have their place, but I'd still say they are not inherent to the word itself, and that a person using one of those taboo words should be judged by their original intent. When I communicate with someone else, the same word can have very different meanings according to who I am and who the other person is, voice tone, other words being used, etc etc. You gave the example of n****r; one of the debates I've heard surrounding that word is how some groups... people whose skin is dark? (I find PC'ness really inconvenient sometimes, btw, and I am missing Spanish right now ) are allowed to use it among themselves. And it is fine, they don't use that word to be offensive and derogative with each other; in those occasions it has positive connotations (and more importantly, all people involved know it. Although the Colombian who called the Mexican "marica" also meant it with positive connotations, the Mexican didn't know it and that's when problems arise).

So following my previous argument, although meaning and connotations are important, they are just one piece of the whole message. What really matters is how the receiver of my message will interpret it. Sometimes I use very heavy words with my cousin, and she similarly uses very heavy words with me, but we know each other very well, and we know the other person will interpret them in the positive way we meant to use in the first place. That makes meanings, in the end, subjective. I am sure there exist at least one case when the word fa***t has been used to describe someone positively and interpreted positivily, and it is my belief there is nothing wrong with that use, when neither party got offended.

Context is key, IMO. There are people that can say it to me and I know they're not being offensive, or at least they're saying it in jest. Usually I'll laugh heartily or return the favour in equal measure. (But then this is in Australia, where the word "bastard" is often used as a term of affection among guys, LGBTI or straight.)

Then there are those who use the term in a denigrating way, and they're the ones who need to be told off some. History shows us that casual intolerance can lead to worse behaviour. Of course, you could argue that this is exactly why such words shouldn't be said at all. That said, my opinion is the same as visagrunt's: know your audience and the situation in which they'll hear you.

Not necessarily true - there are loads and loads of white people that call each other 'n***a' between friends. "How's it goin' my n***a?" - etc etc.



Not in Britain it doesn't. 'Black' is the main descriptive term for, well, black people here. We don't generally call people 'African British' or 'Caribbean British', we would just call them Nigerians or Somalis or Caribbeans or Jamaicans or whatever (rarely is the term 'African' used). We don't use the term 'Asian British' (apart from as like a government census term), we just call them Asian (though Asian usually means only people from the Indian subcontinent).

I have an old boss who is British but with parents of Sudanese descent. He never took kindly to being called black while he has been here, by Aussies, Brits or anyone else. Watching someone call him n***a was the only time I ever witnessed him lose his temper. I'm sure since it doesn't apply to you, it doesn't bother you, but that isn't the case for everyone.

I think it's irresponsible. Even if you know for a fact that you're not a homophobe, when you joke around with those words in public, you never know who might be listening. You might be contributing to the overall atmosphere that says homophobia is no big deal.