Just what does "friend" mean anyway?

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I've never really understood the idea. Not properly. There are things about it that don't make sense.
Every time I've tried asking the mundies about it, I never get the same answer twice, and I never get any real details. Like it is just something they all take for granted that everyone knows and never even bothered to think about what it meant. The term seems to be thrown around a little too liberally these days.

In the past I've had things I thought were friends sometimes, and not entirely sure other times.

I mean... there are persons I know... right? Acquaintances and the like. People I am somewhat familiar with, know things about them, and don't hold them in any particular favour or disfavour...

And there are persons I favour in some form or other... completely independent of their opinions of myself.

But no matter what I've tried in order to emulate the practical experience of "friends" as depicted in just about any media you care to mention (be it television, films, books, games, or even the way others behave around each other)... I can't seem to manage it.
Every time I've essentially asked folk for their time... for hanging out or whatever... no matter how familiar or whatever, including those I've spent time with in person... it is like I'm trying to goad them into it. It always feels like I'm trying to persuade them to put up with me against their better judgement.

It is one of the reasons I quit facebook. Even the persons I thought of as friends... if I didn't explicitly hound them for attention maybe once a month or whatever, in as subtle a manner as I'm capable of.... well... they just ignored me. If I didn't put forth 100% of the effort myself... I just completely slipped off their radar.
And sure enough, when I left Facebook... nothing. Like I just vanished off the face of the world and nobody seemed to notice.


... So just what the hell am I getting wrong?

Is there some sort of reason why just about everyone else can just coalesce into social groups but I don't even have a single mote of social sticking-power? Do I have some sort of passive power of anonymity that causes me to be instantly forgotten by everyone the moment I'm not standing right in front of them?
I know I can be kinda abrasive online (much as I try to cut back on it sometimes)... but I'm not that bad in person... most of the time. Been told as much at least twice.

... So anyway...
Yeah...
Got no friends whatsoever... and somewhat lost my patience with the whole deal.

Friends, today, are people you're connected to on Facebook or casually acquainted with in real life. Non-autistics can have hundreds of such "friends". (I've even known an autistic woman with hundreds of online friends, who admitted that she'd only ever met two or three of them in real life and isn't close even to them.)

What used to be called "friends" when I grew up would probably be called "best friends" now. People you actually know and are close with. People you confide in. These are few, even for non-autistics.

What used to be called best friend, would probably be "BFF" now. Best Friend Forever. This may be only one. Someone you tell your deepest secrets.

Personally, I have hardly more than a dozen connections on Facebook (most of whom I've never met) and only ever had one friend in real life. I thought of him as a "best friend" and we were really close for a year, until he broke off contact without as much as telling me why. That was at uni in England, where people drink lots of beer, so I'm beginning to wonder if this friendship was inherently beer-fueled and he only confided in me because he was drunk so much of the time ...?

Still, this was the only person I was ever feeling a connection with and it was traumatic to lose that connection. To me, that feeling of being connected with another person and enjoying their company is what makes a friendship real. I very much miss it.

That connection can't be forced, though. It's there or it isn't. Sounds like you have a hard time making a connection, too.



I read a few of your posts today. Sounds like our experiences are quite similar. I too felt more at ease with people at uni, for example, at least when I was an undergrad. When I did my masters degrees and during my doctoral studies, I started to realize, though, that people there are just as hypocritical as those outside. Which pretty much is evidenced by your post about politics and bureaucracy standing in the way of actual scientific work. That's spot on.

I don't understand the problem with friendship, either.

When I was a teen, I wrote a very intense letter to all my "friends" telling them why they weren't real friends. Somehow, my mom intervened and kept me from sending out that letter. (Back in the days before email and I handwrote several copies...) Anyways, she read the letter and told me that what I was looking for, I was only going to find in the person I would eventually marry.

I think she was right. And my husband is my best friend.

But what I don't get is why deep friendships don't seem to happen anywhere else. Why can't we have more than one deep friendship? Doesn't anyone want that?

My husband calls most friendships "situationships". We are "friends" with people because we are in the same situation. And when we are no longer in the same situation, that relationship ends. So, it turns out that those "friends" weren't truly personally invested in the relationship.

That bothers me greatly. I *want* deep friends. I want history-changing lifelong friendships.

It is ironic to me that, though probably an Aspie, I want super deep friendships. It is like I think, "If you don't want to get to know the real, deep me, I don't want to get to know the surface-y you."

I have the same trouble, too, that people almost never make any initiative with me. There are plenty of people I talk to on a regular basis mostly due to work. But outside of that very narrow situation, I never hear from anyone. Not a phone call, not an email. I feel like I am begging for favors when I make initiative with people. And often those plans fall through...

I often wonder what is wrong with me to cause all this. And other times, I think it is just that people are self-centered and don't think beyond their own lives and immediate situations. I don't understand why people can't make room for one more friend.

I wonder, too, if people find me too intense. I have curbed that over the years by talking less. And I try to be very careful who I show that to. But, it is hard to tell with whom I might have a connection that would allow me to reveal some of the real, deeper me.

I don't think people call "Facebook friends" friends (without the prefix). The website should say aquitances; probably it was originally for friends and then the word stayed.

They say: "I have 600 friends on Facebook."

Still, they clearly speak about Facebook. If you say you have 1000 dollars in the Monopoly game, you don't mean it's 1000 actual dollars either.

That makes sense.

Not something I'll tend to say often, on account of being generally critical by nature... but that word is... rather an apt sort of descriptor. Makes sense.

Even that sort of stuff was easier in the past.
Back when I was at school, there were others with similar interests that I could hang out with. It was largely a matter of shared proximity though. We were at the same place, besides simply having the interests, so it made sense to bunch together.
At University, everyone for the most part was better company because we were all studying similar things... but there were far fewer I actually hung out with, and again it was due to more shared interests AND shared proximity.

But since then... well... there is only my workplace left... and I don't share any interests with anyone there. They're all insufferably boring. Just a bunch of suits... with suit thoughts and suit opinions and suit preferences. And I can never get back that whole situational proximity-friendship-thingie because I'm not actually obligated to be around anyone I find interesting, and neither are they obligated to be around me either.

I understand.

I do have people I talk to on a regular basis that I am in close proximity to. Some closer than others, but no one *really* close other than my husband.

People at church are probably the closest and know the most of what's going on with me and I with them.

Then there are the parents of the kids I teach (music.)

I homeschool my kids, so I know a few people through the local group, but no one I hang out with or talk to on a regular basis or very deeply.

What about a local group? If I wasn't so busy myself, I'd look into an outdoors group because I like hiking and canoeing and that sort of thing. But my family keeps me pretty busy.

I've tried that in the past.

I used to do pen and paper roleplaying... in a group.... but I left after it was becoming apparent that I was just becoming the scapegoat / buttmonkey of the group... the target of everyone's humour. I didn't really want to go there just to be mocked for everything I supposedly did wrong because I wasn't on the same wavelength as the rest.

Are you into art, music, or drama at all?

I find those people to generally be the friendliest. We artists are all a bunch of weirdos in one way or another so we kind of have to be accepting.

I wish all churches were like my church. The people there are great and accepting of all sorts of people. We have kids with special needs and adults that are from another country and don't speak the language well. Not everyone is super close, but we all care and get along.

I think you have said you are not religious, but maybe, just maybe, you might find a group of accepting people at a church if you visit some.

No. Those things are just distractions.
I used to stick posters up on my walls, but I stopped doing that years ago. No interest. The only purpose I have for music any more is to blot out the yapping of profligates.
As for drama... well, like I said... I used to roleplay. That didn't exactly turn out well. Pre-scripted stuff is just pointless.



I'm a Nihilist.
An Anti-Theistic Nihilist.
I'm hoping that tells you enough to completely close that topic of discussion.

No problem.

It's important to focus on how you make others feel, for example interested in what they have to say, humour is enjoyable, and be careful of whatever makes them feel bad such as criticism and gloominess. What makes people feel good they will want more of.

It's important to focus on how *they* make you feel. No point in pondering to people just for the sake of making "friends". Real friends are people you can be yourself around.

Of course, as long as what you count as "yourself" isn't just bad habits like interrupting, rudeness, insults, negativity.

You describe me perfectly (maybe minus the insults). Sorry, we won't be friends.