Female Autism

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I have read:

. Special interests are more typical of girls their age
. More sociable/emotional/empathetic than autistic males and can more easily pass as NT
. 'Less obvious' stims

I remember once watching A Girl Outside the Box on YouTube and thinking it made sense when I was first learning about autism but now I've just watched a video that I had bookmarked about stimming and she mentions that she saved her 'big stims' (i.e. spinning on her chair) for when she listens to music, and that made me want to throw up, because it's something everybody does. Nice lady but.. misinformation, piles of misinformation, and IMO probably misdiagnosed.

So how does 'female autism' actually present? How can you tell the difference between an autistic female and an NT that is introverted or with other diagnoses? What about BAP?

"because it's something everybody does." No, it isn't. I don't think she was misdiagnosed. Maybe she shouldn't have been diagnosed, but if she shouldn't have been diagnosed she shouldn't have been diagnosed with anything because the problem wouldn't be her not being autistic, but not being severely effected enough.

Essentially, while the traits are less obvious, they are still there. The special interests aren't any less severe, they are just more typical. Though I'm also very skeptical to the claim that male special interests are actually anywhere as non-typical as they are made out to be, plenty of autistic males have very typical male interests. I mean how many autistic boys are really obsessed with fan blades rather than trains, video games, and dinosaurs? In fact the only autistic male who I can think of whose interests I wouldn't consider typical of males is one who is obsessed with Disney musicals, which would be seen as perfectly normal for a girl. There is also the boy obsessed with airplanes, but airplanes are a perfectly normal male interest, it's just the intensity which makes it seem like an abnormal interest. With stims, again, they are still engaging in autistic stimming, that fact it's less noticeable is irrelevant to that. Yes, everyone has stereotypies and tics to some extent, but not to the persistence of in autism. I'll tell you this, I have a friend who while she apparently isn't autistic (while she keeps telling me about how much social anxiety she has, she doesn't come across as having any social problems which autism requires), her personality is pretty much the stereotype of high functioning autism, much more than I am (despite being male, I generally relate more to descriptions of female aspies than male ones). Once she noticed me absent mindly shredding a napkin while I was talking to her, and she remarked she does the exact same thing and I was the only person she noticed doing such a thing. I think she's BAP or something, and it stands that shredding napkins like such is stimming and an autistic trait, it's not something people who are just introverted do. Finally with the more social/emotional/empathetic part, it's my belief that autism itself exists independent of sex hormones, but sex hormones may make autism manifest more severe as more "male" systemizing traits cause autism to become more disabling when combined. Anyway, with these girls, they might be more sociable/emotional/empathetic than the males, but they still manifest as clearly autistic when tested for such, they are still socially impaired in the autistic manner. Remember, less does not mean not. I also think this partially where male-centric autism factors in because if sociability is a feminine trait, than are the girls really less autistic because they more sociable, or is it just girls being girls and boys being boys is being mistaken as having more neurodivergent traits?

What thing that isn't clear to me when people talk about females autism being less apparent in this manner, are they only comparing high functioning people? The reason this is critical to take note of is because autistic girls are much more likely to be diagnosed if they are lower functioning, as IQ goes down, so does the male-female ratio.

"What about BAP?" I think at some level and at some point BAP is just an arbitrary distinction based on the fact autism must be disabling in order to be diagnosed, and if it's less severe it may not be diagnosed. I wonder if women are more likely to be BAP than autistic, and if so, what that would imply.

I think, too, age must be considered. Most kids like to spin. But how long does that last?

I was thinking about this the other day as I was contemplating that I was still spinning at 12/13 years old. Most kids would not still be spinning at that age. I used to also constantly bounce my knee.

I do the tissue/napkin thing when talking, especially in groups. I drum my fingers, "snap" m y toes, click pens. My stims are not so "large" and obvious as when I was younger. They are now smaller, but still irritating to others if I create noise. I still "growl" when concentrating.

I was a girl that did not fit "typical" girl patterns. I was a tomboy, and my special interests were, for the most part, tomboyish except for reading, playing the piano, and writing poetry which are often liked by both boys and girls. My special interests included science and dinosaurs. I had massive collections of shells, postcards, maps, and spoons. One time, I started a collection of dead bugs but quit that when I realized they just stunk. At the time, I loved my collections. Now, I wonder HOW I escaped notice???

But, alas, I grew up in the time before Aspergers/HFA was considered. And, when you're smart, you don't have any problems. Or they are your own doing, caused by a character flaw like laziness or irresponsibility or inattention.

I discovered this lady's blog and find it really helpful in regards to female autism: www.musingsofanaspie.com

Most people over 10 don't spin in their chairs.
I like to skip and run around the house, and I'm nearly 28. I sleep with stuffed animals. In my defense, they are huggable urns.

I certainly don't think my interests are typical for females my age. Let's see-
guns
swords & medieval weapons
building muscle-more sporty than most girls
100 years war

I'm a tomboy, and I promise, I have very little in common with nt women. I'm not a woman, but Im not a man either. A big difference between myself and introverted and nt women is that I dont have nor do i care to have close friends. I could live the life of a hermit and be fine. I've always felt different.

I may be more sociable than nt males, but I'm 100% sure people think Im odd. People know I'm different, they just can't describe why.

I still spin in my chair. I'm 54.

I also shred napkins sometimes.

I enjoy rocking in rocking chairs very much.

Sometimes, I gently knock my head against walls for pleasure. The intensity is controlled. When I get angry, though, the intensity is less controlled (though it's still controlled).

I also like to pretend I'm a football lineman. I "shoulder" walls.

I don't ever have any chairs to spin in.

But, I have a rocking chair and could win a race in that.

You, truly, have to get yourself a spinning piano stool.

It's weird that people can save stims for some other time.
For me, stimming is already going on for awhile before I become aware of it.

The main distinguishing feature of special interest in autism is not the specific topic and how weird it is, but the focus with which it is pursued, to the point of cutting out other things, including other interests, so special interest should be singular, one only can be sustained at the intense level that distinguishes autistic special interest from other people's normal interests. Sometimes, they are also narrow, such that they focus on one aspect only of a broader topic while completely ignoring other aspects, but the topic can be anything.

I don't know how often adults normally spin in chairs. I've had coworkers who'll scoot across the room on wheeled chairs during a slow day if they're bored, though. People get restless.

When I think of stimming, I think of when I was younger and used to tap my feet against things while I was dozing.

The reason it isn't singular is because it isn't one thing for life, changes with time, sometimes rapidly, sometimes slowly. Not all autistic people even have special interests, I wonder if that could be like a hyperadian variant of interest switching.

One thing that should be considered regarding special interests and/or collections is not just the singularity but how one communicates about it.

I showed my collections to family members and my (few) friends that came to my house. Every single postcard. Every single map. Every single shell. Every single spoon. I included all the information about the thing, too. Maybe I didn't show every single collection on the same day. But you better believe you had to sit there and listen to me tell all about it.

I'd also be curious if there has been any study regarding special interests and IQ. Does IQ affect the number, length, or intensity of special interests?

Are you suggesting that women aren't effected by autism as much as men? I would disagree with this. Ability to mask symptoms does not mean the symptoms are not there.

I'll answer based on my 7 year old daughter who is diagnosed with autism.

No. Her interests address not typical of 7 year old girls. Period. She has some interests that might be shared with a seven year old boy like pokemon for instance. However she has some that are just not typical. For example she has several all state insurance company commercials memorized.


No. I can honestly say at this point that she doesn't really have empathy. However, before you call me a monster, in my experience with 7 year old girls (I lead her girl scout troop of 18 girls) that most if not all 7 year old girls utterly lack empathy and the main difference between my daughter and an nt 7 year old is that the nt child feels social pressure and sees benefits to appearing empathetic. However based on what they do in reality as opposed to the lip service they pay and the little act they put on, I don't believe 7 year olds have real empathy. I think it comes later.

She can't pass for nt under most normal circumstances. Usually if you are alone with her one on one just her and an adult they may not notice anything. Put her with other kids? Obvious. Can't pass and didn't want to. She finds other children irritating.


Yes and no. She doesn't flap or rock. Instead she has "ants it the pants", chews on things, and likes head pressure and or to be upside down. And she makes a very very loud throat noise. Like a throat clearing only... no one under the age of 50 needs to clear their throat that frequently or loudly so it's been classed as a stim for her.

I think there is a pretty wide range of special interests, stims, and sociability amongst everyone on the spectrum, there are more differences from person to person than sex I would imagine. Now I think ASD women are probably more tolerated as I think some characteristics are thought as more feminine and demure as opposed to strong-handshake look-you-in-the-eye masculinity if you know what I mean.

I mean one at a time.

Lack of social understanding/comprehension. Which is different to just lack of social skills. I look very NT, I pass for one in my everyday life. But only I'm privy to the fact that most of the time communication sub-context completely bypasses me. It's not like I haven't had enough exposure to this stuff to have simply not developed it. I've been working with people intensely now for a decade. If I was going to learn it like everyone else, I would have by now. The fact remains, I cannot pick it up via observation because I lack the necessary understanding to make sense of what I am seeing.

I am socially skilled (I can mimic social customs) but I lack social comprehension (I do not intuitively understand the reason for the customs nor why they are important). In this situation you can only learn by rote and hope that you don't make a blunder by applying the wrong act at the wrong time. It's not the same as natively knowing when something is appropriate or required.