Not interested/"friend zone"/Give me a chance

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puzzledoll
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24 Dec 2018, 1:20 pm

I have noticed a trend. When someone says they aren't interested in a romantic relationship (for whatever reason) or sincerely wants to be friends, some people get angry and offended. They go, "If you'd just (insert argument that boils down to give me a chance and change your fundamental instinctual response to me) we could be a thing/hook up (often boiling down to 'I won't be alone anymore')."

There are some very basic fundamental issues with this. Let's switch it around. Let's say that your best buddy (of whatever gender you aren't attracted to) turns to you and goes, "Hey, I totally have the hots for you and I think we could be a thing if we give it a go." Now, this is your best bud and you are also completely unattracted to them because you literally physically are not AT ALL. Your response would likely be along the lines of, "Well that was unexpected, I totally love you as a friend, but I'm just not into you that way. I hope that won't affect our friendship."

Now suppose your best friend then turns around and stops wanting to be your friend. They tell everyone you know what a complete jerk you are, how they never liked you anyway, how you treated them like crap and disregarded their emotions AND they heard you sleep around and have diseases and oddly enough also suck at the whole sex thing to top it all off. You can throw kicking kittens in there too if you'd like.

You are now sitting there, hurt and baffled because what the actual heck? I mean, this was your friend who you really cared for. You just weren't into them romantically. It's not like you have control over who you are attracted to, right? Why would they just flip out like this and go after you?

People get up in arms about other people's emotions (or lack thereof) and other people's life choices (if they don't match what someone's opinion says they should be). They pick apart humans they have never even met and never will based off of a line or two of text. None of this makes any sense to me.

If someone isn't into you, they aren't into you. How would you like to be held at gun point and told, "You have to find me sexually attractive and a good potential partner because I think you are?" I mean, this is literally invalidating the other person's humanity. It's saying they can't have their own emotions, their own reactions, they HAVE to react the way you want them to or THEY are the ones in the wrong.

I would like to add this is EXACTLY the wrong way to get people to be interested in you. This behavior is very off putting and if people see you behaving this way it generally drops your "decent human" points in the eyes of the people seeing you do this.



The_Face_of_Boo
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24 Dec 2018, 2:10 pm

Not this topic again.... please...

And this “trend” exists mostly in the internetz and memes, most adults don’t react like that out there in real life.



puzzledoll
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24 Dec 2018, 2:16 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Not this topic again.... please...

And this “trend” exists mostly in the internetz and memes, most adults don’t react like that out there in real life.


Really? That is interesting because I have had close to this exact same discussion with at least two people I know in real life. Adult humans who held jobs and appeared relatively socially adept even.



The_Face_of_Boo
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24 Dec 2018, 2:37 pm

puzzledoll wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Not this topic again.... please...

And this “trend” exists mostly in the internetz and memes, most adults don’t react like that out there in real life.


Really? That is interesting because I have had close to this exact same discussion with at least two people I know in real life. Adult humans who held jobs and appeared relatively socially adept even.


The Friendzone /Nice Guys TM/ Jerks topics have been discussed to death before here.

Hey Alex!! Can you query how many times the term “Nice guys”(exact match) mentioned on this forum?



cberg
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24 Dec 2018, 2:38 pm

Preface: :(

Attraction is a lot more convoluted & inexplicable than I think your post conveys. I don't like to deal in absolutes, particularly not with people I care about.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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24 Dec 2018, 2:40 pm

cberg wrote:
Preface: :(

Attraction is a lot more convoluted & inexplicable than I think your post conveys. I don't like to deal in absolutes, particularly not with people I care about.


Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
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cberg
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24 Dec 2018, 3:27 pm

Quote:
People get up in arms about other people's emotions (or lack thereof) and other people's life choices (if they don't match what someone's opinion says they should be). They pick apart humans they have never even met and never will based off of a line or two of text. None of this makes any sense to me.


^That goes both ways. There's a double standard suggesting that shy guys shouldn't go near women at all because we're not viewed as sexual beings. I think this is quite unfair to any guys who get typecast as asexual when we're not. For that matter not all guys are hung up on physical attraction, there are lots of other kinds, which usually overlap & conflict in any given scenario. I know someone beautiful whom I'm more attracted to for her brain.

What I'm really saying is that this isn't about a black & white yes/no, true/false kind of question. Nobody feels the same way about anybody two days in a row; anyone who wants a chance has to give the other person a chance to feel at ease, it takes time & a lot more effort than the knee-jerk nonsense your OP details.


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Last edited by cberg on 24 Dec 2018, 6:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

puzzledoll
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24 Dec 2018, 6:24 pm

1. I never mentioned "nice guys" or even guys at all in my original post if I remember correctly. There are people of all genders who do this.

2. This is an ongoing issue with people in my real life and it comes up here a lot too. That doesn't mean it being rephrased is going to hurt anything.

3. @cberg Your response confuses me. My comment about people getting up in arms about other people's emotions was aimed at all people getting up in arms about other people's emotions. People seriously need to accept that other people have their own emotions and responses that are completely valid, even if they don't match what other people want them to be, especially in romantic relationships. I know many shy guys. I also know many shy guys in relationships. People need to see each other as people, actual real living people. Just because one person likes another doesn't mean the other person likes them back. I mean of course, if people aren't even bothering to get to know a person before passing judgement that's an issue and one of the things that I directly said was confusing to me.



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24 Dec 2018, 6:30 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
cberg wrote:
Preface: :(

Attraction is a lot more convoluted & inexplicable than I think your post conveys. I don't like to deal in absolutes, particularly not with people I care about.


Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
:rabbit:


For the record, PuzzleDoll is pretty cool & probably not a dark Jedi.


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24 Dec 2018, 6:30 pm

When I was in my 20s, I once asked a girl: "Why don't you love me?"

She said, "I have no idea." She "wanted to," but she just couldn't. She said "you're a nice guy; I wish I could love you."

What could I do? I had to accept the fact that "love" is a most "irrational" emotion. I had to accept her answer at face value.

I was having trouble finding girls to date at that time.



cberg
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24 Dec 2018, 6:35 pm

Well if people need to see each other as people, that should include everyone's thoughts & feelings instead of only those that exclude someone.


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24 Dec 2018, 6:37 pm

puzzledoll wrote:
I have noticed a trend. When someone says they aren't interested in a romantic relationship (for whatever reason) or sincerely wants to be friends, some people get angry and offended. They go, "If you'd just (insert argument that boils down to give me a chance and change your fundamental instinctual response to me) we could be a thing/hook up (often boiling down to 'I won't be alone anymore')."

There are some very basic fundamental issues with this. Let's switch it around. Let's say that your best buddy (of whatever gender you aren't attracted to) turns to you and goes, "Hey, I totally have the hots for you and I think we could be a thing if we give it a go." Now, this is your best bud and you are also completely unattracted to them because you literally physically are not AT ALL. Your response would likely be along the lines of, "Well that was unexpected, I totally love you as a friend, but I'm just not into you that way. I hope that won't affect our friendship."

Now suppose your best friend then turns around and stops wanting to be your friend. They tell everyone you know what a complete jerk you are, how they never liked you anyway, how you treated them like crap and disregarded their emotions AND they heard you sleep around and have diseases and oddly enough also suck at the whole sex thing to top it all off. You can throw kicking kittens in there too if you'd like.

You are now sitting there, hurt and baffled because what the actual heck? I mean, this was your friend who you really cared for. You just weren't into them romantically. It's not like you have control over who you are attracted to, right? Why would they just flip out like this and go after you?

People get up in arms about other people's emotions (or lack thereof) and other people's life choices (if they don't match what someone's opinion says they should be). They pick apart humans they have never even met and never will based off of a line or two of text. None of this makes any sense to me.

If someone isn't into you, they aren't into you. How would you like to be held at gun point and told, "You have to find me sexually attractive and a good potential partner because I think you are?" I mean, this is literally invalidating the other person's humanity. It's saying they can't have their own emotions, their own reactions, they HAVE to react the way you want them to or THEY are the ones in the wrong.

I would like to add this is EXACTLY the wrong way to get people to be interested in you. This behavior is very off putting and if people see you behaving this way it generally drops your "decent human" points in the eyes of the people seeing you do this.

Great explanation.


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cberg
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24 Dec 2018, 6:54 pm

Bad vibes in here though.

We get your drift. People are unlikely to be into some of us.


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24 Dec 2018, 6:55 pm

Depends do you say I don’t want a relationship with you
Or do you say I don’t want a relationship then go on to date someone else.

First person is honest,second is mean in my mind.

Either way the person doesn’t have to be your friend anymore. I won’t be friends with a woman who rejected and I have feelings for.



puzzledoll
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24 Dec 2018, 6:55 pm

cberg wrote:
What I'm really saying is that this isn't about a black & white yes/no, true/false kind of question. Nobody feels the same way about anybody two days in a row; anyone who wants a chance has to give the other person a chance to feel at ease, it takes time & a lot more effort than the knee-jerk nonsense your OP details.


Ah, ok. I think you edited this as I was responding. Nothing is completely black/white. My whole point was that if Person A does not have the emotional or physical response to Person B that Person B wants them to have, forcing the issue or being a jerk about it certainly won't help with Person A's response to Person B, nor will it ingratiate Person B to any of the people witnessing the fiasco. People can't force themselves to love someone, as Kortie mentioned. They can't force themselves to be physically, emotionally or mentally attracted to someone. Those things just happen. Getting pissed off at a person for not having the responses wanted makes the person wanting those responses both less likely to get them and very likely makes them look like an ass as well. In fact it is very likely to make the desired person have less affection for the person trying to force them to and then bad mouthing them because they don't.

Person A of course should be respectful of Person B's feelings for them, but that does not in any way mean they have to return them. Person A should respect if Person B needs to distance themselves to recover from putting it out there and not having it returned. Person A should not mock or belittle Person B for their feelings, just like Person B shouldn't do so to Person A for not returning those feelings.

Does that clarify?

(P.S. I am indeed a pretty cool shiny unicorn and definitely not a sith since there are only supposed to be two and I'd kill myself with a light saber before I figured out how to use the darned thing, although the dark side does have cookies...)



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24 Dec 2018, 7:01 pm

Only time I say they should give me a chance are the ones who solely reject me over my finical situation. They aren’t giving themselves a chance at love either. For all they onow I could have been their dream boyfriend and they could been super happy in love with me. But they deny themselves the opportunity to meet and get to know me, not just me but a lot of good guys. From their social media it seems a lot of the men who meet their requirements turn out to be as*holes, their words not mine. You’d think a rational person would re-examine their system and it’s results. Like him with my requirements I only get mean guys maybe I should change my requirements. They don’t though, if anything they raise the requirements which seems to has to have the opposite effect they want.