Can we AS sufferers reproduce with a clean conscience?

Page 1 of 6 [ 95 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

Kwiksnax
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 9 Dec 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 61

16 Dec 2007, 4:29 am

Let's face it, as much as we try to rationalize our condition and make productive lives for ourselves, we AS sufferers are defective people.

There is a genetic component to AS, so any children we have shall carry the genes that cause our affliction. All the awkwardness we've suffered throughout our lives, all the pain of exclusion and confusion, all the unfairness we face in school and work shall be passed on to the next generation(s) should we choose to have kids. So, knowing this, should we thus deliberately inflict our disorder onto our descendants? Or would it be more socially responsible to let our disorder die with us?

In our case, having kids and raising a family would be a selfish act. We would be doing it for ourselves alone. We would be inflicting our disorder onto the next generation to satisfy our parental instincts. How many of us, given the choice, would choose to have AS over being NT? Not many, if we're honest about it. But our children wouldn't have that choice, just as we didn't have that choice.

Most of us fundamentally dislike who and what we are, and with good cause. We have very little to offer society in real terms. Having intelligence is useless if you lack the social skills to share your gifts with others. Now we've all heard the happy-clappy rhetoric about how everyone is special and everyone has something to offer and people should just accept one another for who they are, but we know in our hearts that this is just the mewling of weaklings and freaks, trying desperately to assuage their despair and rage at being the objects of derision and ridicule to all those around them.

Well, fortunately for the human gene pool, our condition severely limits our opportunities to reproduce anyway. Regardless, would any of you say it is socially irresponsible and cruel for AS sufferers to have children?



Abangyarudo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 603

16 Dec 2007, 4:31 am

Kwiksnax wrote:
Let's face it, as much as we try to rationalize our condition and make productive lives for ourselves, we AS sufferers are defective people.

There is a genetic component to AS, so any children we have shall carry the genes that cause our affliction. All the awkwardness we've suffered throughout our lives, all the pain of exclusion and confusion, all the unfairness we face in school and work shall be passed on to the next generation(s) should we choose to have kids. So, knowing this, should we thus deliberately inflict our disorder onto our descendants? Or would it be more socially responsible to let our disorder die with us?

In our case, having kids and raising a family would be a selfish act. We would be doing it for ourselves alone. We would be inflicting our disorder onto the next generation to satisfy our parental instincts. How many of us, given the choice, would choose to have AS over being NT? Not many, if we're honest about it. But our children wouldn't have that choice, just as we didn't have that choice.

Most of us fundamentally dislike who and what we are, and with good cause. We have very little to offer society in real terms. Having intelligence is useless if you lack the social skills to share your gifts with others. Now we've all heard the happy-clappy rhetoric about how everyone is special and everyone has something to offer and people should just accept one another for who they are, but we know in our hearts that this is just the mewling of weaklings and freaks, trying desperately to assuage their despair and rage at being the objects of derision and ridicule to all those around them.

Well, fortunately for the human gene pool, our condition severely limits our opportunities to reproduce anyway. Regardless, would any of you say it is socially irresponsible and cruel for AS sufferers to have children?


not defective but different and sorry if anyone else has problems with it but I'd reproduce with a clear conscience I'd just work hard on being a father and being the best I can be to be an appriorate role model for my child. Personally whether I end up having AS or Not I'm different and I'm happy cause I am proud of who I am and thats the only thing that would bother me was if I wasn't a person I can be proud of.



Last edited by Abangyarudo on 16 Dec 2007, 4:34 am, edited 2 times in total.

Quatermass
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Apr 2006
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 18,779
Location: Right behind you...

16 Dec 2007, 4:31 am

It would be socially irresponsible for me to have children, but for different reasons. I know I don't have the temperament for raising kids, and might end up murdering any that I have out of sheer frustration.


_________________
(No longer a mod)

On sabbatical...


Kitsy
Supporting Member
Supporting Member

User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,015

16 Dec 2007, 4:33 am

Once apon a time, being intelligent without being socially accepted was okay.

I really don't like the idea of superiority battles people deal with and belittle others into thinking they should have never been born and shouldn't reproduce.

Defective? I'm just fine. Sure others might have different views of me but I'd much rather be myself. It's not me who is the problem, the problem is them.

When was the last time you met someone who accepted you unconditionally and didn't attack you for your differences? That is what I do for people I'm close to and if they cannot give that in return well, I want nothing more to do with them.


_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.

xx Dan Monster


Abangyarudo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 603

16 Dec 2007, 4:35 am

Kitsy wrote:
Once apon a time, being intelligent without being socially accepted was okay.

I really don't like the idea of superiority battles people deal with and belittle others into thinking they should have never been born and shouldn't reproduce.

Defective? I'm just fine. Sure others might have different views of me but I'd much rather be myself. It's not me who is the problem, the problem is them.

When was the last time you met someone who accepted you unconditionally and didn't attack you for your differences? That is what I do for people I'm close to and if they cannot give that in return well, I want nothing more to do with them.


I agreee with you and you expressed it better then I ever could.



gwenevyn
l'esprit de l'escalier
l'esprit de l'escalier

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,443

16 Dec 2007, 4:37 am

Kwiksnax, I think you'll find that not all of us are miserable. I don't think that I "suffer" more than the folks Quatermass refers to as "Soap Opera People". :P I'm happier all by myself than they appear to be, with all their dozens and dozens of so-called friends. I see sides of issues that people who talk all the time don't even notice. I would like not to have to struggle so much in the social realm, but I think I am closer to being self-actualized than I would have been without symptoms of AS.


_________________
The machine does not isolate man from the great problems of nature but plunges him more deeply into them. -Antoine de Saint Exupéry


Kwiksnax
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 9 Dec 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 61

16 Dec 2007, 4:44 am

Kitsy wrote:
It's not me who is the problem, the problem is them.

The mantra of the insane.

Quote:
When was the last time you met someone who accepted you unconditionally and didn't attack you for your differences? That is what I do for people I'm close to and if they cannot give that in return well, I want nothing more to do with them.

So, you "unconditionally" accept people on the condition that they accept you?



Kwiksnax
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 9 Dec 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 61

16 Dec 2007, 4:45 am

Quatermass wrote:
It would be socially irresponsible for me to have children, but for different reasons. I know I don't have the temperament for raising kids, and might end up murdering any that I have out of sheer frustration.

I admire your honesty, and I'm glad to know that you can perceive your limits and act accordingly.



Kwiksnax
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 9 Dec 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 61

16 Dec 2007, 4:46 am

gwenevyn wrote:
Kwiksnax, I think you'll find that not all of us are miserable. I don't think that I "suffer" more than the folks Quatermass refers to as "Soap Opera People". :P I'm happier all by myself than they appear to be, with all their dozens and dozens of so-called friends. I see sides of issues that people who talk all the time don't even notice. I would like not to have to struggle so much in the social realm, but I think I am closer to being self-actualized than I would have been without symptoms of AS.

That's fine, but can you guarantee your children would see it the same way? Would you force AS onto anybody?



Kitsy
Supporting Member
Supporting Member

User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,015

16 Dec 2007, 4:48 am

Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
It's not me who is the problem, the problem is them.

The mantra of the insane.

Quote:
When was the last time you met someone who accepted you unconditionally and didn't attack you for your differences? That is what I do for people I'm close to and if they cannot give that in return well, I want nothing more to do with them.

So, you "unconditionally" accept people on the condition that they accept you?


Nice spin attempt. I accept someone unconditionally but at the same time, I am not a door mat. There is a limit. When it comes down to cutting the cord on friendships where there is alot of drama or betrayal, I do it.


_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.

xx Dan Monster


Averick
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Mar 2007
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,709
Location: My tower upon the crag. Yes, mwahahaha!

16 Dec 2007, 4:49 am

I have really thought about this before and i say, "why not have kids when you are ready?"

Maybe us Aspies should wait until our mid thirties when we are more stable and sure of ourselves. Get married, get a dog, or just get a fern and not kill it. We are smart people, and we can raise smart kids. Integrity is possible if you look...



Abangyarudo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 603

16 Dec 2007, 4:49 am

Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
It's not me who is the problem, the problem is them.

The mantra of the insane.
Quote:
When was the last time you met someone who accepted you unconditionally and didn't attack you for your differences? That is what I do for people I'm close to and if they cannot give that in return well, I want nothing more to do with them.

So, you "unconditionally" accept people on the condition that they accept you?

I assume he does its like for instance that you can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped. I gather from what he wrote that he has more fruitful relationships then he believes he would have had without AS.



Kwiksnax
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 9 Dec 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 61

16 Dec 2007, 4:51 am

Kitsy wrote:
Nice spin attempt. I accept someone unconditionally but at the same time, I am not a door mat. There is a limit. When it comes down to cutting the cord on friendships where there is alot of drama or betrayal, I do it.

It wasn't spin, I admire you for your self-respect and the way you stick up for yourself. But none of us accept anyone unconditionally, and if we value honesty we shouldn't pretend that we do.



Abangyarudo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 603

16 Dec 2007, 4:52 am

Averick wrote:
I have really thought about this before and i say, "why not have kids when you are ready?"

Maybe us Aspies should wait until our mid thirties when we are more stable and sure of ourselves. Get married, get a dog, or just get a fern and not kill it. We are smart people, and we can raise smart kids. Integrity is possible if you look...


can you elaborate on the intergrity part? I don't understand you as I look at integrity is a learned trait and Idon't believe AS would effect that ? Am I wrong in this assumption or did I merely miss the point of what you meant?



Kitsy
Supporting Member
Supporting Member

User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,015

16 Dec 2007, 4:52 am

Averick wrote:
I have really thought about this before and i say, "why not have kids when you are ready?"

Maybe us Aspies should wait until our mid thirties when we are more stable and sure of ourselves. Get married, get a dog, or just get a fern and not kill it. We are smart people, and we can raise smart kids. Integrity is possible if you look...


Agreed. Also, I'm very skeptical of someone with small post counts that come in attempting to cleanse the gene pool of people with AS.


_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.

xx Dan Monster


gwenevyn
l'esprit de l'escalier
l'esprit de l'escalier

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2007
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,443

16 Dec 2007, 4:52 am

Kwiksnax wrote:
gwenevyn wrote:
Kwiksnax, I think you'll find that not all of us are miserable. I don't think that I "suffer" more than the folks Quatermass refers to as "Soap Opera People". :P I'm happier all by myself than they appear to be, with all their dozens and dozens of so-called friends. I see sides of issues that people who talk all the time don't even notice. I would like not to have to struggle so much in the social realm, but I think I am closer to being self-actualized than I would have been without symptoms of AS.

That's fine, but can you guarantee your children would see it the same way? Would you force AS onto anybody?


I can't guarantee they'll like having brown hair or a high IQ or near-sightedness or a slightly bent sternum or anything else that might happen to them.

What's your point?


_________________
The machine does not isolate man from the great problems of nature but plunges him more deeply into them. -Antoine de Saint Exupéry