Comparision of JPS and KJV: Isaiah 53

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(1) 'Who would have believed our report? And to whom hath the arm of the LORD been revealed?
(2) For he shot up right forth as a sapling, and as a root out of a dry ground; he had no form nor comeliness, that we should look upon him, nor beauty that we should delight in him.
(3) He was despised, and forsaken of men, a man of pains, and acquainted with disease, and as one from whom men hide their face: he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
(4) Surely our diseases he did bear, and our pains he carried; whereas we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
(5) But he was wounded because of our transgressions, he was crushed because of our iniquities: the chastisement of our welfare was upon him, and with his stripes we were healed.
(6) All we like sheep did go astray, we turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath made to light on him the iniquity of us all.
(7) He was oppressed, though he humbled himself and opened not his mouth; as a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and as a sheep that before her shearers is dumb; yea, he opened not his mouth.
(8) By oppression and judgment he was taken away, and with his generation who did reason? for he was cut off out of the land of the living, for the transgression of my people to whom the stroke was due.
(9) And they made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich his tomb; although he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.'
(10) Yet it pleased the LORD to crush him by disease; to see if his soul would offer itself in restitution, that he might see his seed, prolong his days, and that the purpose of the LORD might prosper by his hand:
(11) Of the travail of his soul he shall see to the full, even My servant, who by his knowledge did justify the Righteous One to the many, and their iniquities he did bear.
(12) Therefore will I divide him a portion among the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the mighty; because he bared his soul unto death, and was numbered with the transgressors; yet he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

(1) Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed?
(2) For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.
(3) He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
(4) Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
(5) But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
(6) All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
(7) He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
(8) He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
(9) And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
(10) Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
(11) He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
(12) Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors

(1)

מי4310 האמין539 לשׁמעתנו8052 וזרוע2220 יהוה3068 על5921 מי4310 נגלתה׃1540


(2)

ויעל5927 כיונק3126 לפניו6440 וכשׁרשׁ8328 מארץ776 ציה6723 לא3808 תאר8389 לו ולא3808 הדר1926 ונראהו7200 ולא3808 מראה4758 ונחמדהו׃2530

(3)

נבזה959 וחדל2310 אישׁים376 אישׁ376 מכאבות4341 וידוע3045 חלי2483 וכמסתר4564 פנים6440 ממנו4480 נבזה959 ולא3808 חשׁבנהו׃2803

(4)

אכן403 חלינו2483 הוא1931 נשׂא5375 ומכאבינו4341 סבלם5445 ואנחנו587 חשׁבנהו2803 נגוע5060 מכה5221 אלהים430 ומענה׃6031

(5)

והוא1931 מחלל2490 מפשׁענו6588 מדכא1792 מעונתינו5771 מוסר4148 שׁלומנו7965 עליו5921 ובחברתו2250 נרפא׃7495

(6)

כלנו3605 כצאן6629 תעינו8582 אישׁ376 לדרכו1870 פנינו6437 ויהוה3068 הפגיע6293 בו את853 עון5771 כלנו׃3605

(7)

נגשׂ5065 והוא1931 נענה6031 ולא3808 יפתח6605 פיו6310 כשׂה7716 לטבח2874 יובל2986 וכרחל7353 לפני6440 גזזיה1494 נאלמה481 ולא3808 יפתח6605 פיו׃6310

(8)

מעצר6115 וממשׁפט4941 לקח3947 ואת853 דורו1755 מי4310 ישׂוחח7878 כי3588 נגזר1504 מארץ776 חיים2416 מפשׁע6588 עמי5971 נגע׃5061

(9)

ויתן5414 את854 רשׁעים7563 קברו6913 ואת854 עשׁיר6223 במתיו4194 על5921 לא3808 חמס2555 עשׂה6213 ולא3808 מרמה4820 בפיו׃6310

(10)

ויהוה3068 חפץ2654 דכאו1792 החלי2470 אם518 תשׂים7760 אשׁם817 נפשׁו5315 יראה7200 זרע2233 יאריך748 ימים3117 וחפץ2656 יהוה3068 בידו3027 יצלח׃6743

(11)

מעמל5999 נפשׁו5315 יראה7200 ישׂבע7646 בדעתו1847 יצדיק6663 צדיק6662 עבדי5650 לרבים7227 ועונתם5771 הוא1931 יסבל׃5445

(12)

לכן3651 אחלק2505 לו ברבים7227 ואת854 עצומים6099 יחלק2505 שׁלל7998 תחת8478 אשׁר834 הערה6168 למות4194 נפשׁו5315 ואת854 פשׁעים6586 נמנה4487 והוא1931 חטא2399 רבים7227 נשׂא5375 ולפשׁעים6586 יפגיע׃6293

(1) WhoH4310 hath believedH539 our report?H8052 and toH5921 whomH4310 is the armH2220 of the LORDH3068 revealed?H1540

(2) For he shall grow upH5927 beforeH6440 him as a tender plant,H3126 and as a rootH8328 out of a dryH6723 ground:H4480 H776 he hath noH3808 formH8389 norH3808 comeliness;H1926 and when we shall seeH7200 him, there is noH3808 beautyH4758 that we should desireH2530 him.

(3) He is despisedH959 and rejectedH2310 of men;H376 a manH376 of sorrows,H4341 and acquaintedH3045 with grief:H2483 and we hidH4564 as it were our facesH6440 fromH4480 him; he was despised,H959 and we esteemedH2803 him not.H3808

(4) SurelyH403 heH1931 hath borneH5375 our griefs,H2483 and carriedH5445 our sorrows:H4341 yet weH587 did esteemH2803 him stricken,H5060 smittenH5221 of God,H430 and afflicted.H6031

(5) But heH1931 was woundedH2490 for our transgressions,H4480 H6588 he was bruisedH1792 for our iniquities:H4480 H5771 the chastisementH4148 of our peaceH7965 was uponH5921 him; and with his stripesH2250 we are healed.H7495

(6) AllH3605 we like sheepH6629 have gone astray;H8582 we have turnedH6437 every oneH376 to his own way;H1870 and the LORDH3068 hath laidH6293 on him(H853) the iniquityH5771 of us all.H3605

(7) He was oppressed,H5065 and heH1931 was afflicted,H6031 yet he openedH6605 notH3808 his mouth:H6310 he is broughtH2986 as a lambH7716 to the slaughter,H2874 and as a sheepH7353 beforeH6440 her shearersH1494 is dumb,H481 so he openethH6605 notH3808 his mouth.H6310

(8) He was takenH3947 from prisonH4480 H6115 and from judgment:H4480 H4941 and whoH4310 shall declareH7878 his generation?H1755 forH3588 he was cut offH1504 out of the landH4480 H776 of the living:H2416 for the transgressionH4480 H6588 of my peopleH5971 was he stricken.H5061

(9) And he madeH5414 his graveH6913 withH854 the wicked,H7563 and withH854 the richH6223 in his death;H4194 becauseH5921 he had doneH6213 noH3808 violence,H2555 neitherH3808 was any deceitH4820 in his mouth.H6310

(10) Yet it pleasedH2654 the LORDH3068 to bruiseH1792 him; he hath put him to grief:H2470 whenH518 thou shalt makeH7760 his soulH5315 an offering for sin,H817 he shall seeH7200 his seed,H2233 he shall prolongH748 his days,H3117 and the pleasureH2656 of the LORDH3068 shall prosperH6743 in his hand.H3027

(11) He shall seeH7200 of the travailH4480 H5999 of his soul,H5315 and shall be satisfied:H7646 by his knowledgeH1847 shall my righteousH6662 servantH5650 justifyH6663 many;H7227 for heH1931 shall bearH5445 their iniquities.H5771

(12) ThereforeH3651 will I divideH2505 him a portion with the great,H7227 and he shall divideH2505 the spoilH7998 withH854 the strong;H6099 becauseH8478 H834 he hath poured outH6168 his soulH5315 unto death:H4194 and heH1931 was numberedH4487 withH854 the transgressors;H6586 and he bareH5375 the sinH2399 of many,H7227 and made intercessionH6293 for the transgressors.H6586

Number 1, what is the meaning of this?

So, are the differences between these two translations too vast to amount to the same thing, or are they similar enough to count as the same passage?

If you mean, "what is the point?", then here is my question:



I have heard some people argue that the Bible has been over-translated through multiple languages. Both of these texts have been translated from the Hebrew, one by Jewish people and the other by Christians. Isaiah 53 is a key passage since it is a Messianic passage, where Christians (rightfully I think) interpret it to refer to the Messiah, Jesus, and non-Messianic Jews (or some of the Rabbis anyway) interpret it to refer to the people of Israel. So, if there are going to be any difference in translation, here would be one of the more major passages for, even, willful deviation from source text.

I have heard some people argue that the Bible has been over-translated through multiple languages. Both of these texts have been translated from the Hebrew, one by Jewish people and the other by Christians. Isaiah 53 is a key passage since it is a Messianic passage, where Christians (rightfully I think) interpret it to refer to the Messiah, Jesus, and non-Messianic Jews (or some of the Rabbis anyway) interpret it to refer to the people of Israel. So, if there are going to be any difference in translation, here would be one of the more major passages for, even, willful deviation from source text.

The two texts seem pretty similar. Enough that I would substitute one for the other, thus, I would argue that Christianity and Judaism do not have significant enough differences on translation of this text, just one on interpretation.

Damn it Riker, the text just shows up as numbers and computer symbols in my browser.

I see very little difference between teh two. What do you see as teh differences.

I would think there's more difference in a KJV vs a modern english version.

1 Who has believed what we have heard?
And who has the arm of the LORD been revealed to?

2 He grew up before Him like a young plant
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no form or splendor that we should look at Him,
no appearance that we should desire Him.

3 He was despised and rejected by men,
a man of suffering who knew what sickness was.
He was like one people turned away from;
He was despised, and we didn't value Him.

4 Yet He Himself bore our sicknesses,
and He carried our pains;
but we in turn regarded Him stricken,
struck down by God, and afflicted.

5 But He was pierced because of our transgressions,
crushed because of our iniquities;
punishment for our peace was on Him,
and we are healed by His wounds.

6 We all went astray like sheep;
we all have turned to our own way;
and the LORD has punished Him
for the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet He did not open His mouth.
Like a lamb led to the slaughter
and like a sheep silent before her shearers,
He did not open His mouth.

8 He was taken away because of oppression and judgment;
and who considered His fate?
For He was cut off from the land of the living;
He was struck because of My people's rebellion.

9 They made His grave with the wicked,
and with a rich man at His death,
although He had done no violence
and had not spoken deceitfully.

10 Yet the LORD was pleased to crush Him,
and He made Him sick.
When You make Him a restitution offering,
He will see [His] seed, He will prolong His days,
and the will of the LORD will succeed by His hand.

11 He will see [it] out of His anguish,
and He will be satisfied with His knowledge.
My righteous servant will justify many,
and He will carry their iniquities.

12 Therefore I will give Him the many as a portion,
and He will receive the mighty as spoil,
because He submitted Himself to death,
and was counted among the rebels;
yet He bore the sin of many
and interceded for the rebels.

1 Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed?

2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.

3 He was despised and rejected by men,
a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering.
Like one from whom men hide their faces
he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

4 Surely he took up our infirmities
and carried our sorrows,
yet we considered him stricken by God,
smitten by him, and afflicted.

5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was upon him,
and by his wounds we are healed.

6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to his own way;
and the LORD has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before her shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.

8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away.
And who can speak of his descendants?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was stricken.

9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.

10 Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand.

11 After the suffering of his soul,
he will see the light of life and be satisfied ;
by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.

12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.

1WHO HAS believed (trusted in, relied upon, and clung to) our message [of that which was revealed to us]? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been disclosed?

2For [the Servant of God] grew up before Him like a tender plant, and like a root out of dry ground; He has no form or comeliness [royal, kingly pomp], that we should look at Him, and no beauty that we should desire Him.

3He was despised and rejected and forsaken by men, a Man of sorrows and pains, and acquainted with grief and sickness; and like One from Whom men hide their faces He was despised, and we did not appreciate His worth or have any esteem for Him.

4Surely He has borne our griefs (sicknesses, weaknesses, and distresses) and carried our sorrows and pains [of punishment], yet we [ignorantly] considered Him stricken, smitten, and afflicted by God [as if with leprosy].

5But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our guilt and iniquities; the chastisement [needful to obtain] peace and well-being for us was upon Him, and with the stripes [that wounded] Him we are healed and made whole.

6All we like sheep have gone astray, we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord has made to light upon Him the guilt and iniquity of us all.

7He was oppressed, [yet when] He was afflicted, He was submissive and opened not His mouth; like a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so He opened not His mouth.

8By oppression and judgment He was taken away; and as for His generation, who among them considered that He was cut off out of the land of the living [stricken to His death] for the transgression of my [Isaiah's] people, to whom the stroke was due?

9And they assigned Him a grave with the wicked, and with a rich man in His death, although He had done no violence, neither was any deceit in His mouth.

10Yet it was the will of the Lord to bruise Him; He has put Him to grief and made Him sick. When You and He make His life an offering for sin [and He has risen from the dead, in time to come], He shall see His [spiritual] offspring, He shall prolong His days, and the will and pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in His hand.

11He shall see [the fruit] of the travail of His soul and be satisfied; by His knowledge of Himself [which He possesses and imparts to others] shall My [uncompromisingly] righteous One, My Servant, justify many and make many righteous (upright and in right standing with God), for He shall bear their iniquities and their guilt [with the consequences, says the Lord].

12Therefore will I divide Him a portion with the great [kings and rulers], and He shall divide the spoil with the mighty, because He poured out His life unto death, and [He let Himself] be regarded as a criminal and be numbered with the transgressors; yet He bore [and took away] the sin of many and made intercession for the transgressors (the rebellious).

The main difference I notice is the translation of Chalah as "disease" in the JPS, but that doesn't really change what I see as the apparent meaning within the rest of the text.

well, it can be claimed that the books from the Old Testament at least, to lack of errors in translation during the time, about it's accuracy or "perfection", although that would seem to be more related to the Hebrew Bible (Old Testament), the issue is that there seem to be some variations from the manuscripts from the dead see scrolls with the masoretic texts, and what would be the indication given that I wonder, and the question of wether comparisons of all the OT books can be made or just a selected number of them. The New Testament seems to differ in that aspect, there are missing parts in older manuscripts and some changes as well, which would make the NT to be less accurate in translation than the OT if that's the case. Anyway, it all seems to be something that may be still under debate.

Read Isaiah 7:14 in translation. If you see the word "virgin" consign it to the flames. That is NOT what the Hebrew is.

The word "virgin" is an artifact of the Greek translation from the Hebrew. The Hebrew in Isaiah is "almah" meaning a young women of marriageable age. When the TNKH was translated into Greek, the closest word in Greek was pathenos which when translated into Latin is rendered virgo or virgin. In short, it is a mistranslation.

Bob Kolker

Why bother with translations? Learn Hebrew and read it in the original language.

Bob Kolker

How does this relate to 53? Though I suppose
a young woman conceiving would be out of the norm...